"You Are The Difference!"

Photography DiscussionHDR_ how many exposures do you need?

User avatar
Charles Haacker
Mentoris Primus
Mentoris Primus
Posts: 1841
Joined: Mon May 01, 2017 7:20 pm
Location: Lincoln, Nebraska, USA
Social Media Opt-In: No
Editing option: No, please do not edit my images
Contact:

Re: HDR_ how many exposures do you need?

Post by Charles Haacker » Wed Apr 25, 2018 11:03 pm

pop511 wrote:
Wed Apr 25, 2018 8:43 am
Interesting set of responses. I am yet to use my latest camera Canon 1dxMkii for hdr, but I know the old one Canon 1ds Mkii has an exposure range of 10 1/3 stops extrapolated. I know that if inside a building and bright sun through any window, I cannot get detail from outside with detail inside. I have to make a choice as to proper exposure for the scene I wish to cover, or do hdr. That being said I want to come back to my original argument.
Those of you on this forum that have used hdr, can you try my experiment. Merge all sequences by whatever method you use, then, merge your low and high exposures only.
I am curious as to what results you get and your reports.
Kind regards;
Ed, I promise I will take a crack at this as soon as I can, but maybe not before you leave.

Duck, you said
Nowadays, with the increased range of capture from modern sensors (raw capture) I find I can push the post processing enough to expand the dynamic range without tone mapping.
That's precisely why I have done so little HDR.

But Ed, you said
I know that if inside a building and bright sun through any window, I cannot get detail from outside with detail inside.
That would be the challenge I will try to find, and do a normal 3 or 5 shot spread, then try the minimum and maximum. This ought to be interesting. One thing I would remark, though, is that my experience has been that the dynamic range of modern digital is so great that (in raw at least) I will usually expose for the interior, let the window go well to the right, but by cutting highlights in Lightroom I get a result that looks (to my eye) "normal." To me the window does not need to retain much detail since I'm thinking of it as background. I just don't want it to be garishly bright and clipped. Anyway lemme see what I can come up with. (Y)
Friends call me Chuck. :photo: This link takes you to my Flickr albums. Please click on any album to scroll through it.
(I prefer to present pictures in albums because I can put them in specific order.)

All the great photographers use cameras! No, really. :|

User avatar
Steven G Webb
Mentoris Alumnus
Mentoris Alumnus
Posts: 221
Joined: Wed Jan 14, 2015 4:12 am
Location: Saluda, SC
Social Media Opt-In: Yes
Editing option: No, please do not edit my images
Contact:

Post by Steven G Webb » Thu Apr 26, 2018 12:26 am

pop511 wrote:
Wed Apr 25, 2018 8:43 am
Interesting set of responses. I am yet to use my latest camera Canon 1dxMkii for hdr, but I know the old one Canon 1ds Mkii has an exposure range of 10 1/3 stops extrapolated. I know that if inside a building and bright sun through any window, I cannot get detail from outside with detail inside. I have to make a choice as to proper exposure for the scene I wish to cover, or do hdr. That being said I want to come back to my original argument.
Those of you on this forum that have used hdr, can you try my experiment. Merge all sequences by whatever method you use, then, merge your low and high exposures only.
I am curious as to what results you get and your reports.
Kind regards;
I went back to my first trial of HDR which is 5 exposures (-2, -1, 0, +1. +2) I merged only the two extremes. The result differed from the merge of all five, mostly in the smoothness of the transition of shadow to highlight. I'll re-do and go with only the -1 and +1 images as they are more aligned with the popular method of capture.
If you've never failed you've never tried.
Holly Ridge Photography
Facebook

User avatar
Duck
Key Founding Member
Key Founding Member
Posts: 2525
Joined: Tue Nov 25, 2014 6:31 am
Location: Shelton, CT
Social Media Opt-In: Yes
Editing option: Yes, feel free to edit my image
Contact:

Post by Duck » Thu Apr 26, 2018 1:12 am

Steven G Webb wrote:
Wed Apr 25, 2018 11:02 am
Earlier there was mention that HDR in film required sandwiching negatives. Orton's effect was similar. Using one over exposed negative and one under exposed being part of the process. I threw it out there from nostalgia for film manipulation talk.
I was wondering, and this makes sense once you pointed out the connection. Thanks.
"If you didn't learn something new today, you wasted a day."
Image ImageImageImageImage

User avatar
Steven G Webb
Mentoris Alumnus
Mentoris Alumnus
Posts: 221
Joined: Wed Jan 14, 2015 4:12 am
Location: Saluda, SC
Social Media Opt-In: Yes
Editing option: No, please do not edit my images
Contact:

Post by Steven G Webb » Thu Apr 26, 2018 2:30 am

Duck wrote:
Thu Apr 26, 2018 1:12 am
Steven G Webb wrote:
Wed Apr 25, 2018 11:02 am
Earlier there was mention that HDR in film required sandwiching negatives. Orton's effect was similar. Using one over exposed negative and one under exposed being part of the process. I threw it out there from nostalgia for film manipulation talk.
I was wondering, and this makes sense once you pointed out the connection. Thanks.
You're welcome. Sometimes I pretend to be smart. Other times I try to get out of my car with the seat belt still on.
If you've never failed you've never tried.
Holly Ridge Photography
Facebook

User avatar
pop511
Mentoris Dominus
Mentoris Dominus
Posts: 564
Joined: Sat Dec 13, 2014 2:29 am
Location: Sydney,Australia
Social Media Opt-In: Yes
Editing option: Yes, feel free to edit my image
Contact:

Post by pop511 » Thu Apr 26, 2018 1:05 pm

"" I went back to my first trial of HDR which is 5 exposures (-2, -1, 0, +1. +2) I merged only the two extremes. The result differed from the merge of all five, mostly in the smoothness of the transition of shadow to highlight. I'll re-do and go with only the -1 and +1 images as they are more aligned with the popular method of capture. ""
Thanks Steve;
I am yet to do more experimentation, and I found my results somewhat similar to you but I found richer dark tones.
Where my post falls down is unless we are talking about the same camera and methodology in software used we can argue all day and each is correct but opposite in what we found.
Am I correct it that last statement? No bloody idea.
Have fun:
ed davis

User avatar
Steven G Webb
Mentoris Alumnus
Mentoris Alumnus
Posts: 221
Joined: Wed Jan 14, 2015 4:12 am
Location: Saluda, SC
Social Media Opt-In: Yes
Editing option: No, please do not edit my images
Contact:

Post by Steven G Webb » Thu Apr 26, 2018 7:53 pm

pop511 wrote:
Thu Apr 26, 2018 1:05 pm

Where my post falls down is unless we are talking about the same camera and methodology in software used we can argue all day and each is correct but opposite in what we found.
Am I correct it that last statement? No bloody idea.
Have fun:
Hey Ed,
One of the things I enjoy about discussions about photography with photographers is the variety in opinion, results, methods. Just like those old school aptitude tests where there are no right or wrong answers, when it comes to something subjective as photography there many, many times no right or wrongs (tongue in cheek: how could there be when there are no rules). I love it that five photographers can stand next to each other and shoot the same scene with as many as five different exposures, crops and compositions and all of them right. I think you are right in your summation. So long as the arguments are civil I think it's okay debate all day long.
If you've never failed you've never tried.
Holly Ridge Photography
Facebook

User avatar
Charles Haacker
Mentoris Primus
Mentoris Primus
Posts: 1841
Joined: Mon May 01, 2017 7:20 pm
Location: Lincoln, Nebraska, USA
Social Media Opt-In: No
Editing option: No, please do not edit my images
Contact:

Post by Charles Haacker » Thu Apr 26, 2018 8:15 pm

Steven G Webb wrote:
Thu Apr 26, 2018 7:53 pm
Hey Ed,
One of the things I enjoy about discussions about photography with photographers is the variety in opinion, results, methods. Just like those old school aptitude tests where there are no right or wrong answers, when it comes to something subjective as photography there many, many times no right or wrongs (tongue in cheek: how could there be when there are no rules). I love it that five photographers can stand next to each other and shoot the same scene with as many as five different exposures, crops and compositions and all of them right. I think you are right in your summation. So long as the arguments are civil I think it's okay debate all day long.
100% agree! It's subjective. How many almost-to-blows virtual barfights have we seen over silly stuff like jpeg vs. raw, Nikon vs. Canon (I use Sony), film vs. digital, Yankees vs. Mets (whatever)? I confess to sometimes using that goshawful old saw, "There's more than one way to skin a cat" (and it happens I like cats). Photography is an art form. There is a certain validity in almost any picture if for no other reason that it represents a literal fraction of a second in time that will never (so far as we know) come again. 8):
Friends call me Chuck. :photo: This link takes you to my Flickr albums. Please click on any album to scroll through it.
(I prefer to present pictures in albums because I can put them in specific order.)

All the great photographers use cameras! No, really. :|

User avatar
Duck
Key Founding Member
Key Founding Member
Posts: 2525
Joined: Tue Nov 25, 2014 6:31 am
Location: Shelton, CT
Social Media Opt-In: Yes
Editing option: Yes, feel free to edit my image
Contact:

Post by Duck » Thu Apr 26, 2018 10:15 pm

Steven G Webb wrote:
Thu Apr 26, 2018 7:53 pm
I love it that five photographers can stand next to each other and shoot the same scene with as many as five different exposures, crops and compositions and all of them right.

Oh, so true. That's why I like getting together with other photographers in meetups (even if most are amateurs). When it comes time to share you can see the different perspectives and learn from them. At least I do. Many times I've had that, "wow! I didn't think to do it THAT way!" moment, resulting in a red mark on my forehead from my palm. :doh:
"If you didn't learn something new today, you wasted a day."
Image ImageImageImageImage

User avatar
pop511
Mentoris Dominus
Mentoris Dominus
Posts: 564
Joined: Sat Dec 13, 2014 2:29 am
Location: Sydney,Australia
Social Media Opt-In: Yes
Editing option: Yes, feel free to edit my image
Contact:

Post by pop511 » Fri Apr 27, 2018 2:11 am

Charles; Duck:
Glad we can all laugh, even though there is a serious side to my post.
The question now is..How do I get Charles and Duck to fight!!!

Just thought of a postscript to this.
The two of you go off and do a three exposure in hdr.
Then take the -2 and +2 and process them...hehe
ed davis

User avatar
Duck
Key Founding Member
Key Founding Member
Posts: 2525
Joined: Tue Nov 25, 2014 6:31 am
Location: Shelton, CT
Social Media Opt-In: Yes
Editing option: Yes, feel free to edit my image
Contact:

Post by Duck » Fri Apr 27, 2018 2:36 am

pop511 wrote:
Fri Apr 27, 2018 2:11 am
Charles; Duck:
Glad we can all laugh, even though there is a serious side to my post.
The question now is..How do I get Charles and Duck to fight!!!

Just thought of a postscript to this.
The two of you go off and do a three exposure in hdr.
Then take the -2 and +2 and process them...hehe
What? Why? Charles is a kindred spirit (we even have the same first names).
You're mean :p
"If you didn't learn something new today, you wasted a day."
Image ImageImageImageImage

Post Reply
  • Similar Topics
    Replies
    Views
    Last post

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 3 guests